Im all about modest clothing, but I cant tell you how many sermons I have sat through where the man of God railed against women wearing slacks. Throughout all your conjecture you based none of you opinions on scripture. Anyhow he screamed through most of it (funny I never see Jesus screaming at folks, particularly His followers) told some fantastic tales, not saying he was lying, but, well you know what I mean. An Independent Fundamental Baptist church exists for the sole purpose of evangelizing the world with the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ. The Baptist church that I attend used the entire Bible, all 66 books. It is surely an affront to any historically informed Baptist identify him by the name of a group that has so hated and persecuted them down throughout history. I also believe that hanging around with non-Christians is detrimental to ones faith as I have done this. Your reasoning is faulty. The one caution I would give is to allow God to speak to you through the scriptures, that is the most critical. Some of his former congregation in Salem joined him and they set up a colony. ABSOLUTELY we teach tithing if you dont want to give a tenth back to the God that saved your soul from hell, then I wonder if youve met the same God that I have. That shows your lack of emotional maturity. In the simplest of terms a true Baptist assembly is one which follows the New Testament as his sole authority for his faith and practice. (I Corinthians 15:1-4) Further, if a person is truly saved and strictly follows the principles of the New Testament he will in a true sense be a Baptist whether he uses the name or not. This is the biggest wrong teaching of the Churches of Christ, although you have lots of company in this wrong belief, it is still wrong teaching. The form contains many questions about doctrine and philosophy of ministry. He can make it without out $$$, but we need to learn to let go of it. Im not sure how they upkept thier Synagogue & relate dcostbut if Im not mistaken I learned during a conference that they actually gave more than our equivalent of a tenth in regards to thier goods/wealth (like mince, spices, etc)and perhaps separate monetray covered that cost or these items were bartered/traded to pay bills. It is well also to note that these five distinctives are traits also of the true New Testament church! But wouldnt Paul himself, or the original church to whom the letter was sent, count as outside authority and control? John was Gods true prophet and the forerunner of the Messiah Jesus Christ, but he was not a part of the dispensation of the institution of the local church. Two champions of religious liberty were the Virginians Thomas Jefferson and Patrick Henry. God leads us as we depend upon the Holy Spirit and keep His Word. This was the birth of Protestant churches. If it furthers & advances the Kingdom of God (the Church, Evangelism, Missionaries, etc), then I believe it is going to God. While every effort has been made to follow citation style rules, there may be some discrepancies. No one I have ever talked to or debated can show me that money is ever to be considered a tithe. The Dutch colony of New York for a time persecuted Baptists within its territories. The Baptist bases his authority solely on the Bible itself. It is well to note the Pilgrims were also Puritans, and Puritans were Protestants who had left the Church of England. Some have pointed to the Anabaptists as the examples of early Baptist churches. The Independent Baptist believes that to join with churches who teach and practice false doctrine is condone and even show approval of Biblical error and that all doctrinal error is sin. The Association of Fundamental Baptist Churches in the Philippines AFBCP is an organization guiding cooperative ministries of Independent Baptist Christs death ushured in teh New Covenant where ceremonial law for the remission of sin is replaced with grace and mercy. (1 Tim. These first Baptist churches formed in England were Armenian in theology, which taught that all men could be saved. We are an old-fashioned, independent, fundamental, King James Bible only, soul-winning Baptist church. I find it difficult sometimes to keep Gods sovereignty and my responsibility in balance. (1 Tim. Its derived from two possible origins: 1. We are friendly Fundamental Independent Baptists, k ind-of like the church your grandparents might have once attended. And to top it off you have very strange sayings that I have no idea what they mean, the last half of the verse at Acts 9:5 is an example It is hard for thee to kick against the pricks WHAT! If that were the case, Paul left out the most important person/position in addressing the Phillipian saints. Thus the words Independent and Fundamental have been added by many Baptist churches to further identify themselves as truly Bible believing churches and to show a distinction between themselves and Baptist churches who were not following Gods word. The Puritans were dissenters from the Church of England. My sister left the church years ago and is living in sin (even by the standards of other denominations so please dont take it out of context), but I talk to her every day. In a biblical church the pastor is the overseers or leaders of the congregation. In 1631, he arrived in Boston. Do you think you can bring others to Christ in this manner? We must agree with John Smyth, the true New Testament church is founded on its belief and practice of the Scriptures, and not on any outward succession of a visible or invisible organization. Bob So true, the subject that I simply couldnt justify (there were several) with my old fundy churchs teaching with scripture, was tithing. Any idiot can do that. His resources are free from this sight. Ok, so Im pretty sure you are referring to the Church of Christ that was founded by good ol Thomas Campbell (1763-1854) He was a fine Scottish Presbyterian who left Ireland to come to western PA. in 1807. For example inn Isle of Wight county in southeastern Virginia, Baptist preachers were taken to Nansamond River, nearly drowned by Episcopalians to show their contempt for Baptists beliefs in immersion and their rejection of infant Baptism. In 1684, a Baptist church in Maine seeking greater religious liberty was relocated to Charleston, South Carolina. Share this: There is not one Protestant church that is doctrinally pure following the example and polity of the New Testament. Fundamental Baptists are strict in interpreting the Bible in a literal sense. The form is submitted along with the recommendations of other Calvary Chapel clergymen. Even some TV evangelists have referred to themselves as being fundamentalist. Your use of scripture only shows your ignorance of it. God alone has that authority and He in the person of the Holy Spirit brings conviction and salvation to those who in simple faith believe. Certainly we are not responsible for people we never have an opportunity to witness to. Greetings, @Lynne I appreciate your dedication and your spirit to pursue what God would have for you in the area of giving. People sin, and people attend churches. Any church fellowship that encourages avoiding another Christian denomination/fellowship, even if they uphold & believe these, b/c they are not of the same denomination are in gross error & a cult. The best illustration of this point can be made this way. It is an important part of the church. NOT ONE. 8. The purpose of the Law being fullfilled we should do all good works in Christ for we are saved to do good works. But it is for these very reasons that I and millions of other Americans cant understand it. PO BOX 292. They wanted to bring reform to the Church of England. She and another church lady had this discussion and the other lady said that to her it is a bigger sin to stay in an abusive, unloving marriage such as the one my mother was in, and I agree whole heartedly. The faulty logic here comes from not paying attention to the Scripture. So wonderful to hear you are making progress in your spiritual journey. Please note that this presented no problem for this first Baptist church in America. Ive experienced this kind of power over and over again in the church. The name Fundamental Independent Baptist is of recent origin and came into being because many modern day Baptist churches compromising the Word of God and teaching and practicing false doctrines. Praise the Lord she started going back to church recently. The new testament says Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. that pretty much destroys the idea of someone being forced to give. PASTOR PAUL DYCK. As many theologians saywe can agree to disagree on some things but when it comes to the Fundamental of the Christian Faithbased on by the way what God says in the Word, then thats when one should draw the line b/c its no longer a matter of Christians in various fellowships & preferances that are allowable but then becomes a matter of even being a Christian at all (like Mormonisn, Jehovahs Wittness, Catholics, etc). Jesus didnt find it necessary to dress differently than anyone else, why should the MOG? God knows if he ever accepted Jesus Christ as his Saviour. Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. The study of Gods word deserves more time than this life holds. If you want to be under law, you need to keep all 613 commandments of the Mosaic law. I really dont know how to describe it. They are worlds apart. When it's Time To Leave Thoughts on Breaking Away, 73. For instance, if I was regularly wearing a swim suit or Scooby Doo costume to any Church I would probably be asked to Change into something more appropriate. In 1678, shortly after the church had erected a new building, the Puritan controlled government nailed its doors shut and forbade anyone under penalty of the law to enter or worship there. The connection with past churches for the modern Baptist is not the name, but rather their doctrine and practice. 2) tell you what kind of music to listen to I attend an Independent Baptist church and Ill answer your questions For another example, our neighbor is a lost man. The word Independent means that the church is not a member of any council, convention or is a part of any hierarchy outside the local congregation. I am not trying to be overly critical and yet I only have a certain amt of time to get to my points and while doing that I often come across that way, so forgive me. Drinkers go to the next town to buy their drinks. Other Anabaptists groups were in gross error and corrupted. They dont tell us what to wear more than any other church. I read what you wrote, thats why I replied with what I wrote. Please excuse me. Select worship style. Nor can I know the heart of those I preach to. LEARN MORE ABOUT THE DANGERS OF THE MODERNIST CHURCH He told me that he attends a independent Baptist Church and stressed the importance of the small ( i ) in the name. Still today, many Protestants see the Lords Supper as a sacrament, having to some degree saving properties or giving some spiritual benefit. The more and more that I looked into it and studied the scripture, I realized not only were they wrong they were *completely* wrong about tithing, in fact, they didnt have a clue, and this was the standard teaching throughout the IFB. They tried to establish that according to history, Baptists have an unbroken line of churches since Christ. Im sorry Brother Irv, but you are wrong. WHEN AND WHERE WAS THE FIRST RECORDED BAPTIST CHURCH IN HISTORY. I thought that this was the passage you were referring to. Particular Baptist had their beginnings around 1616, when some dissenters left the Church of England and were lead by the Rev. As long as they go to a God fearing church that believes in Jesus Christ and they themselves are not rebelling against God then it would not hurt my feelings if they went to Southern Baptist or Methodist churches. KJB. The first Baptist church in New York was started by William Wichendon, in 1656. When a congregation results from the preaching of the Gospel, authenticating that congregation as a New Testament church rests solely on its doctrine and practice.not in its affiliation. 3:1-16) However, some Independent Baptist churches do not accept that the word officer is the proper biblical term to be used and particularly does not apply to deacons. 4 Reasons Christians Are Wrong About Homosexuality, 63. What does the Bible say about the way Christians should dress? If it isnt to much trouble please explain your assertion. They called themselves Baptists because that was the best name they could choose to describe what they believed and the name identified them a Bible believing people. I was always told ten percent and thats I give for the most part unless I cant afford it in which case I give what I can. About this time the Puritans were also becoming strong in England. There were nine original members of the church which included two women. Later, the Dutch issued new orders and allowed religious liberty. A tithe was to be given by Jews under law to a levitical priest and as far as I can tell, it was always a product from the land, be it animals or some sort of plant life. But if your axe is based on tithing being practiced & encouraged (no one mandates & makes me give)then you have a axe with much of Christendom. The over the years the growth of so many false and idolatrous practices caused some within the Catholic church such as Martin Luther to rebel, and to try to reform the Catholic church. Nope, dont see that. . Clearly, he was banished because he believed in religious freedom and believed and taught the New Testament was a believers sole source for his faith and practice. In fact, no church on earth can make that claim. Today the name Baptist is used by many churches who are not truly following the teachings of the New Testament. I grew up in a Catholic church and boarding school, then was taken out and placed into Lutheran surroundings. BEREAN BAPTIST CHURCH. (For a explanation of the biblical role of deacons please go to http://bible-truth.org/deacon.html, The pastor of the church is called by majority vote of the congregation. I saw Jesus there and the Holy Spirit! Failure to pay the tax brought the wrath of the civil and church leaders and people were publicly beaten, placed in stocks, fined, imprisoned, and banished from the colony by the civil authorities under the direction of the Puritan church officials. You have it backwards. These new believers would then, following the New Testament example, submit to believers baptism and organize a local church. Thats kind of like being an American and never knowing enough about the nations beginnings to be able to make an intelligent decision about whether some politician is leading us away from freedom. I do dislike what seems to be human effort in trying to do what only the Spirit of God can do through a clear presentation of the word of God. . . Knolleys was imprisoned many times and suffered at the hands of the State Church. I myself wear pants and outside of church most of the other women do too. The Anabaptists were mostly a God-fearing group of people. Note..I, no particular denomination. Just because everyone else is doing it doesnt mean its correct. If I were asked to compare the church I attend with another denomination that I knew about. How can you not see that? CALVARY BAPTIST CHURCH. What Is An Independent Fundamental Baptist? A side note, my sons group In Search Of Reason has been selected to play for CreationFest this year. A true New Testament church bases its faith, practice and authority solely in the Word of God. I suppose I should have asked a couple of questions first, to which group of The Church of Christ are you referring? Just curious. I do like your nice touch of calling us idiots though. To call these people Baptists or Baptistic, in the sense the believed the Bible and followed it as their sole authority for faith and practice, in the same way true Baptist churches do today, is acceptable, although it serves no purpose. What we believe at Fundamental Baptist Church about Jesus, the Bible, and the Church. Thanks for your response. Its nothing personal, just logic. Biblically neither Deacons or Trustees are a governing body, or a board, but titles of special appointed servants who serve at the will of the pastor and congregation. than we pray that they will get right with God Dress codes are not the problems. First anytime a mans name is attached to a system of theology my antennae go way up, think Campbell, Calvin, Arminius, Smith etc. We use our monetary resources alone. From http://procinwarn.com/ccclergy.htm: Most people do not realize that Calvary Chapel church organizations are not, themselves, affiliated with the original Calvary Chapel in Costa Mesa, California. @greg In 1606, after nine months of soul-searching and study of the New Testament he was convinced that the doctrines and practices of the Church of England were not Biblical, and thus he resigned as priest and left the church. I already estb basis of why Tithing I believe is good (must read all post under Lynne). Again adhering to correct doctrine and proper practices should be the focus in our lives. Im not sure about this one. The Official Independent Baptist Rulebook, Known in Some Churches as Church Standards Thou shalt obey the pastor at all times Thou shalt obey all adults at all times if you are a child or teenager Thou shalt obey your husband at all times if you are a woman Thou shalt obey your parents at all times That godly Deacon, so righteous on the outside, may have deep dark unrepentant sins no one know about. It was horrible. A prime example of the dangers of belonging to a convention is seen in the apostate Southern Baptist Convention. First I would disagree that The Church of Christ teaches first century, new testament doctrine. You place too much value on modern denominational history. It is not the name or the organization that makes a Biblical church, but its practice of the faith as revealed in the New Testament. Shortly after the Church of England fell from grace when the English monarch was overthrown and the Presbyterians became the favored church of the state. 2.) Independent Fundamental Baptist churches have fellowship one with the other and often cooperate in such endeavors as evangelism. Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they Benedict states that the English Roman Catholics in 1535, put to death twenty two Baptists for heresies. I went on to share with her that in that same passage it says, singing psalms, hymns (which by the way modern churches are throwing out) and spiritual songs. An Independent Baptist Church would not be apart of a national organization that would exercise authority over the local church. Just some thoughts. I am not in favor of tactics that play on peoples emotions so as to secure a visible result. Our Pastor teaches that Baptism does not save us and is no a requirement of salvation. Furthermore I believe it involved religion. I think it is exactly right to see that without divine drawing, no one ever would come to Christ. Thus, history and the doctrines of Protestantism clearly show that Baptists are not Protestants. In Amsterdam, he with Thomas Helwys and thirty six others formed the first Baptist church of English people known to have stood for baptism of believers only. The ones Ive attend are really good. It is my conviction that it is not possible to trace an unbroken line of Baptist churches from Christ until today. A church only has authority to set guidelines on dress as it is addressed in Scripture. It did not produce a succession of other churches, but those who founded it went on to set up other Baptist churches in England. But anyway he says that if those folks go to Hell, that their blood would be on your hands. It is well to note that not all Virginians felt this way. He became an outspoken Separatist or dissenter of the State church. Any professed church that does not recognize these is Apsotasy & not the Church. Total. The Presbyterians took over the job of persecution biblical believers and forbade Knolleys from preaching in parish churches. Many men have suffered and given their fortunes and their lives to hold the name in truth. As a matter of fact, you cannot be a member of a Calvary Chapel. It is the Word of God, the Bible, that makes up what is a real and true church! Greg, Im sure you realize all this, but I thought I would throw my voice in it. I assume you are referring to the errant position that many Pastors, Deacons, or Elders have taken placing themselves between God & Man. He was much displeased with the Puritan theocracy. Have a look at Matthew 15. In Europe, Protestant churches are state churches and supported to some degree by government imposed taxes. 601 1ST AVE SE . I met him about 25 years ago and our spirits bore witness that we are the sons of God. Don't expect anything contemporary or liberal. He is not nearly as fundy as where I left from, and is learning. You CANNOT be loving either if you are refusing to render unto the Lord that which is his, and this includes tithing. However, history is clear that in the beginning and into the 9th Century there were churches in Britain that rejected pedo-baptism, popery and other false doctrines of the Catholics. Thousands of Southern Baptist Churches didn't baptize a single convert last year. About. It helped start the first Baptist church in Philadelphia the following year. He did not fail to share truth although He was not yet crucifiedso likewise I argue that since He said it should not have been left undoneHe meant what He says as He shared the fuller meaning I believe of the Laws. So Im guessing that pretty much every Church other than Ivor Church has a dress code. 2. I dont know what you are referring to by saying they dont use the O.T.? 451 Likes, 8 Comments - Spencer Smith (@spencersmith312) on Instagram: "I was saved at 18 at an independent, fundamental baptist church. If your church does teach the following then watch out, you are probably in a manipulating extreme IFB church situation. The person, John the Baptist. My study of the word psalms is that it includes singing with a musical instrument. @greg He strongly believed in separation of church and state and upheld the principles of soul liberty. Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. Psalm 137:9. However, bottom lineJesus never shared but truth to all incl Phairsees so if His position on tithing was as being not to be left undonethan I believe it stands as something that is good to do, pleasing to God. Also, you keep mentioning Jesus statement about not leaving tithing undone. The New Testament teaches the absolute autonomy of each local church who is to govern itself as the Word of God instructs free from outside authority and control. Rachael God bless you!!
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